[Matroska-general] matroska menue system, was : ratdvd?

ChristianHJW christian at matroska.org
Tue Nov 8 23:29:42 CET 2005

Dexter Filmore schrieb:

> Hm, guess, that's a "no"...
>> On Mon, 07 Nov 2005 16:01:07 -0700
>> Mike Melanson <mike at multimedia.cx> wrote:
>>	Play what now? Never heard of 'ratdvd'. Are you referring to this?
>>   http://www.ratdvd.dk/
 >>> Dexter Filmore wrote:
 >>> Can xine or any player in linux at all play ratdvd?
 >>> If not, support planned?

Are the specs of their 'self made' video codec open now, so that a 
decoder based on a free library could be implemented ?

When ratDVD came out there has been quite some hype about it. Soon after 
that, people found out that the 'container' they made is basically a ZIP 
file, with some DVD like file structure inside (mainly a copy of the 
source DVD). Only the MPEG PS video streams have been replaced by their 
own compression, but are obviously still embedded in a kind of MPEG 

What was making this project very interesting for us is the DVD like 
menue navigation DirectShow filter they released with the win32 
binaries, allowing to play the files, including menues, in Windows Media 
Player. The feel and looks was like playing a DVD. They were stating on 
their homepage that their menue naviagtion filter is self made and based 
on libdvdnav. We were anxious to have a look at the code, as we are 
facing similar problems as they must have had initially, to support our 
matroska menue system (which exists already in working code since 4 
months BTW, in specs even longer) in WMP and other DirectShow based players.

However, the ratDVD devs found a nice workaround to not have to release 
the full filter source code, they wrapped libdvdnav in a COM object and 
released this part of the code only, the filter itself is closed source 
same way as the encoder and the rest of the program. We believe this is 
a clear GPL violation (libdvdnav), because the filter will not work at 
all without the lib (it will depend to 100% on it, thats clear). When we 
  made this public we were accused of wanting to steal the code for our 
own filter, being stupid because the matroska menue system is very much 
different than of ratDVD. However, it was enough for us to shut up about 
it and leave it to the libdvdnav devs to handle that, or not.

For me personally its clear that the ratDVD devs have commercial 
interests. Otherwise, they would open up their sourcecode ?

Speaking of the matroska menue system, we have plenty of files on our 
HDDs including menues, and full spec compliant (here : 
http://www.matroska.org/technical/menu/index.html ). Most of the current 
files are using extracted menues from source DVDs, using our tool 
DVDmenuXtractor. What we are currently lacking for full menue support is

- player support. robux4 is working on implementation into VLC, basic 
functions working fine already, full release expected in 4 - 10 weeks

- a free matroska menue editor. Some people in the team are now working 
on an editions editor, a first step into the direction of a menue 
editor. However, thats still a loooong way to go.

matroska project admin

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